Costco Gun Ban
READ
RESPONSES HERE
We received the following email from a member, who
had
heard that Costco Wholesale warehouse clubs had banned
firearms in their stores. Read the letter, and the response
from Costco below. While JPFO agrees that Costco has the
right to restrict firearm possession on their premises, we
also believe that firearms supporters have the right to
protest with their dollars, by not shopping at Costco.
If you're a Costco member and decide to discontinue
your
membership as a result of this policy, we suggest that you
make sure that Costco knows why!
And don't forget to read the new book _Guns
in the Workplace_ by Chuck Klein. It's available through
Amazon.Com and at booksellers nationwide.
- The Liberty Crew
-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxx
Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 4:16 PM
To: Investor Relations
Subject: Banning guns
I heard through the grapevine that Costco had banned
guns
in their stores.
Please confirm or deny the allegation.
Thanks.
-----Costco Response-----
From: Stephanie Bradley [mailto:sabradley@costco.com]
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 12:43 PM
To: Investor Relations
Subject: RE: Banning guns
Dear Mr. xxx,
This email is in response to your October 20, 2006
letter
to our Investor Relations department, regarding Costco's
"No Firearms" policy at its warehouse stores.
As an initial matter, Costco is not a place of "public
accommodation" within the meaning of civil rights laws. The
definition of "public accommodation" does not include
a bona fide private club or other establishment that is not in
fact open to the public. Costco Wholesale is a membership-only
warehouse club. It is not open to the general public. It restricts
membership to a limited group of qualified individuals who agree
to membership conditions. We have the right, and the obligation
to our members, to enact and enforce membership rules. The Member
Service Employees at the exit doors are obliged to follow these
rules. By obtaining a Costco membership card, our members agree
to comply with the Membership Rules and the Privileges and Conditions
of membership.
Costco does not believe that it is necessary for
firearms
to be brought into its warehouse stores, except in the case
of authorized law enforcement officers. For the protection
of all our members and employees, we feel this is a
reasonable and prudent precaution to ensure a pleasant
shopping experience and safe workplace. Our policy is meant
to protect our members and employees in all warehouses
around the world. This is not a new policy and we do not
customize the policy for each individual
city/county/state/country where we do business.The shopping
experience is not enhanced by bringing a firearm into our
warehouse.
Our primary goal at Costco Wholesale is to keep
our members
happy.
Sincerely,
Stephanie Bradley
Executive Assistant to:
. . Joel Benoliel - SVP-Legal &
Administration
. . Paul Latham - VP-Membership,
Marketing & Services
sabradley@costco.com
RESPONSES
FROM OUR READERS
---------------------------------
I certainly would not join Costco, and told my wife
the same thing - she was considering joining. Costco membership
dues is $50; perhaps some JPFO members will donate the $50 to
JPFO for a campaign against Costco.
---------------------------------
Many of Oklahoma's democrats who won office had
NRA endorsement. As a Jew, I get sick of hearing the family value
bullcrap. Fact is there are a lot of Democrats who want to protect
gun ownership - and some that even have families. I am a Reblican
who just happens to vote for people not parties. My plan is simple:
My guns are not for huntng; they are stricly for shooting targets
and killing people. I can can be shot dead, but not likely disarmed
before I become a martyr. So the idea is to focus on getting good
people - not parties into the catbird seats. I intend to make
it through lif without taking a human life, but if I do - it will
be one that needed to be taken. A bumper sticker that says "Jesus
was a Democrat" should be stuck on every pickup driven by
a Jew.
-----------------------------------
Well do they or do they not allow concealed guns
in the stores?
I've never seen any signs and we shop at the Colorado
warehouses every week.
I've never seen anything in the membership agreements
either, though we signed
those years ago, before concealed carry was even passed here.
And state law says they gotta post signs if they
don't want concealed carry.
I did ask at Sam's Club and they apparently have
identical policies, but only
if someone asks, and only via email. If they don't post the required
signs, I
don't think people can get in legal trouble for it in Colorado.
---------------------------------------
I have shopped many times at the 2 Costco stores
in the St. Louis area. In MO, if a storekeeper does not want to
allow guns in his store, a sign to that effect must be posted
at the entrance. Ubiquitous as such signs are in the St. Louis
area (which is full of gun-banners), I don't remember ever seeing
such signs at Costco. Sounds to me like their "one size fits
all" policy, which does not take state laws into account,
leaves them without a legal leg to stand on in quite a few states,
since it seems to mean that they do not comply with local or state
laws on the matter.
I am cancelling my membership, anyway, but, admittedly, largely
because I have recently moved too far away from any of MO's Costco
stores to make it worthwhile.
------------------------------
The following is the e-mail that I sent to Ms. Bradley
regarding the no guns policy of Costco:
Dear Ms. Bradley,
While I recognize that you very likely do not have the authority
to change the current COSTCO "No Firearms" policy, I
thought that you would like to know that here in Plano, TX, there
are at least 2 Sam's Club warehouses that do not prohibit lawful
possession of a concealed handgun on their premises. Several of
my friends are Concealed Handgun Licensees here in the State of
Texas. I shall assure that ALL of my correspondents and friends
know of this policy so that they can take their business and their
dollars to Sam's Club.
Regards,
RK
Lt Col, USAF (Ret.)
----------------------------------
While I have read the costco letter before I came
to your sight, my membership application to costco makes no mention
of guns and here in Colorado a large sign at the entrance is required
to stop cwp holders from entering with their weapons. This has
not happened here in Colorado yet.
If it is just mentioned in their membership papers all then can
do is take your membership back. Big Deal!
Regards,
RG
-----------------------------
Why don't we call these people what they really
believe in :pro-criminal pro-slavery and pro genocide :history
attests to this as a fact, that cannot be denied. The criminals
have a new parking lot full of unarmed victims all costco customers
are easy prey for the picking ,the criminal element thanks costco
very much especially at the holiday season . concerned ex-costco
customer
----------------------
As a CWP holder, do as I do! Don' let them know
you have one. First of all that is what it is, a concealed weapon.
Why would you want to tell anyone at costco upon entering their
store that you are armed. It is consealed, they
have no way of knowing you are armed.
I have been in there stores, and I have not seen
any metal detecters nor any one beeing searched. I would rather
be charged with a mistermeaner and be armed, than be robbed leaving
there store or be assaulted in there parking lot and not be armed.
Yes, every one should try to follow Gods Laws and the laws of
the land and not break any of them, but this is why he gave us
repentance, 7x 70 each day. I beleive God gave us the right to
protect ourselves, and I'm sticking to it.
Same as the bank I use, it has a little sign on
there door so small most do not even know it is there. I carry
there to, but If the bad guy wants to rob the bank, so be it,
they are insured. But if he points his gun at me and no one is
in the line of fire I am going to shoot first if at all possible.
The gun range I went to in Florida had the little
sign on the door, but I carried there also.
Thanks for your time!
Sincerely,
BS
-------------------
Dear Ms. Bradley
My name is [JG] and I have been a police officer
for that last 18 years, 9 with the [redacted] Police Department
and the last 9 with the[redacted] Police Department. I have been
a Costco member since the mid-1980's. My current position is detective
as well as a department rangemaster and firearms trainer. I also
am responsible for training and certifying the CCW permit holders
within my jurisdiction. First off, I understand that the new corporate
ban on firearms in your stores does not affect me. However, as
a police officer and investigator, I would like to present another
down side to this policy.
Recent surveys have shown that about 80% of police
officers in California support the right for law abiding citizens
to obtain a CCW permit and carry as they see fit within the restrictions
of that permit. I for one am not afraid of a good citizens firearm
and I know that crime diminishes is areas where there are armed
citizens. That is a good thing. I am not a lawyer, but I would
presume that Costco has the right to ban firearms in their stores.
The problem is that by doing so you have not stopped CCW holders
from carrying their weapons, you have only succeeded in compelling
them to leave their guns unattended in their cars out in your
parking areas. And for all intents and purposes have advertised
this to the criminals who have access to your stores.
Criminals have a knack for finding guns in cars
and most experienced criminals can get into a locked car in under
30 seconds. If I were a criminal and I wanted a gun, my first
stop would now be the Costco parking lot, where I would know that
I could likely obtain a gun and have plenty of time to do it.
My next target would be the store, because I would know that it
is unlikely that any good guys would be armed inside. I feel that
FBI statistics will support a prediction that your new policy
will make Costco's patrons and employees less safe and a will
serve to make Costco properties a desirable target for criminals.
To use a metaphor, No flock of sheep was ever saved
by de-fanging the sheepdog, for it is the sheepdog's fangs that
keep the wolves at bay.
Thank you for taking the time to read this.
Respectfully
Det. [redacted]
----------------------------------------
As per your article about Costco, I carry a card
that I leave at places that do not want my business. It is worded
as such, and is a version of one that that an Eastern gun Org.
came up with. It is calling card size and printed on both sides,
can be made by almost any one with a bit of knowledge about computers
and printing. I checked with the club and they said that it was
not copyrighted or protected in an way.
I hope you can use it.
I have noticed you're sign, and am going to respect you're wishes
by taking my business elsewhere. you have lost my business now
and in the future I will also inform my friends of your wishes.
Reverse side
As an Oregon concealed Handgun license Holder. I
- Have no felony convictions (lifetime)
- Have never been convicted of any drug offense
- Have no mental defects or disabilities
- Have passed a criminal history background check
How much do know about your other customers?
Thank you for you time-
I remain yours,
JL
-------------------------------------
I called Costco and asked them about this and asked what other
civil rights we needed to give up to be a "member".
Did they plan to next ban black people, Jews, maybe restrict free
speech or even start requiring people to wear signs that show
their party affiliation?
Call them! Tell them you are thinking of buying
memberships for your whole family. then ask about the gun policy
and let them know you will go to SAMS and buy the memberships!
1-800-774-2678
Ask them how many criminals their policy will keep out? ZERO,
but it will keep lots of honest citizens out.
JS
-----------------------------------
Dear Ms. Bradley, Mssrs Benoliel and Latham:
I recently received a copy of your letter (below)
outlining CostCo's rationale for banning lawfully carried firearms.
Owners of private property can, under the law, institute
whatever policies they like, however, I am concerned that this
policy may not have been clearly thought out. Specifically, the
stated "reasoning"
doesn't make much sense, especially in light of recent school,
church, synagogue and other shootings where the perpetrators likely
considered these premises to be "defenseless victim zones"
because of their "no guns" policies.
Who, exactly, do you think will "obey"
your gun ban? Surely you don't believe that someone who has already
decided to commit capital murder cares about another misdemeanor
for violating your gun ban!
Granted, "the shopping experience" may not be "enhanced
by bringing a firearm into [your] warehouse", unless one
needs it to prevent some miscreant from killing one's family or
making one's wife a widow!
Obviously, law-abiding gun-owners hope never to need a gun for
this kind of situation, but, should one arise, it could be their
only means of survival.
Surely you understand that your "authorized
law enforcement officers"
cannot respond to a 9-1-1 call fast enough to protect anyone,
and, according to numerous US Supreme Court decisions, they have
"no affirmative duty" to do so, even if they could.
Whether CostCo believes it "necessary for firearms
to be brought into its warehouse stores" or not, does not
alter the fact that a "no guns"
policy creates a criminal-friendly environment where a predator
can commit mayhem with little concern that a lawfully-armed civilian
might intervene. By instituting such a policy, and posting "no
guns"
signs, you are literally inviting criminals to prey upon your
members, and increasing the likelihood that innocents will be
killed, maimed or injured in your stores. The world is dangerous
enough without advertising where there are large congregations
of defenseless victims; and that is what your "no guns"
policy does to law-abiding CostCo members!
Regarding your assertion that "Our primary
goal at CostCo Wholesale is to keep our members happy" -
I respectfully suggest that members who take seriously their obligation
and duty to protect themselves and their families by lawfully
carrying a firearm will, becasue of this policy, cease to be "happy
members" - if they remain members at all!
I am now a former CostCo member, and I will not
renew or patronize your stores again until this dangerous policy
is abandoned. As there is a nearby Sam's Club (which has no such
policy), this is not much of a hardship.
Sincerely,
DK
--
"After a shooting spree, [why do] they always want to take
guns away from the people who didn't do it."
William Burroughs, 1992
--------------------------------------------------
Dear Stephanie Bradley:
I read your e-mail about guns in Costco. I have never seen
a gun in Costco, and I did not know there was a problem.
In your letter it states that "Our primary goal at Costco
Wholesale is to keep our members happy. "
I had always thought that Costco's goal was to make a profit.
Now that criminals know that Costco is a gun free location,
it sure makes the criminals job easier as the criminals now
know that they can rob Costco with NO risk to themselves.
Perhaps Costco goal should be making shopping at Costco
and pleasant and SAFE experience, while making a profit at
the same time. It has been proven over and over that where
there are no guns, crimes increase and with self defense tools,
crime goes down.
What I am saying is that if you remove the gun ban, and state
that people can carry their private defense tools and that
employees at Costco may be carrying self defense tools then
Costco will be less of a target for criminals.
Has the leadership thought about the lawsuits they may incur
if criminals attack Costco and there is NO way people can fight
back.
If Costco has made it an environment safe for criminals, Costco
will be liable for these attacks and may be sued.
I am a Costco member, and it would NOT make me unhappy,
if I saw citizens wearing guns. I would THEN feel safer,
just as if I was carrying a gun, it would make others there
safer because I would be protecting Costco members from
criminals.
Sincerely, MN
-----------------------------
Good morning all,
I've read your justification for banning firearms in your warehouse
stores, and I find it offensive and without merit. Forget that
you've completely ignored the 2nd Amendment, forget that your
policy creates 'defenseless victim' zones similar to our public
schools which have proven to be quite attractive targets for our
criminal element, and, forget that you seem to have missed the
point that it is the individual's responsibility to ensure his
or her own safety. Your argument fails on the premise that lawful
weapons carry does not enhance the shopping experience. On the
contrary, the absence of my personal carry weapon seriously detracts
from my 'shopping experience'. Without my weapon I must divert
a good deal more of my focus to assessing the degree of risk presented
by those around me, identifying which of your inventory items
might make suitable self-defense weapons, and remaining aware
of how far I will need to run to reach cover when the shooting
starts.
When discussing firearms carry, there are only two possible scenarios
worthy of consideration - carrying one and not needing it, or
not carrying one and wishing you had. The consequences of the
first are limited to minor inconvenience, while those of the second
are often fatal.
You do not sell anything that is worth that risk.
Please cancel my membership. The number is [redacted]. Please
send my refund to [redacted].
Best of Luck,
GL
----------------------------------------------
this is what I emailed Ms Bradley....
Dear Ms Bradley,
Your statement below shows Ignorance and prejudice
towards lawful gun owners who want to do nothing more than to
be able to protect themselves and possibly fellow shoppers if
the need arrises. This kind of policy doesn't protect anyone except
the criminal who if he wanted to could just waltz right in and
started killing people because you and your company policy basiclly
disarmed everyone except the criminal. Are you and your company
prepared for a lawsuit if just an occurance happens and are you
prepared to deal with your Conscience by allowing your shoppers
to be like sheep when the wolf arrives? I hope nothing ever happens
but if it does, I hope someone with more intelligence chooses
to disregard your dangerous policy and carry concealed so they
can put a stop to it before it starts or got worst.
With Regards,
JG
------------------------------------------
Dear Ms. Bradley,
I recently read your response to another member who inquired about
your policy of banning legally carried firearms in Costco stores.
Just to let you know, this policy does not make many of your members
"happy," which you state is your goal. I have carried
a firearm as a law enforcement officer and under the authority
of a Concealed Handgun License. Much of the time, I do not carry
a weapon, even though I am authorized to do so. But I am always
nervous when I enter places that proclaim weapons are banned.
Criminals do not abide by laws, much less membership rules.
In the holiday season of the year which is just around the corner,
parking lots are one of the most dangerous places in America.
Your policy assures that all the law and rule abiding members
who enter or exit your store will be unarmed.
In the past 15 years, we have seen violent crime in the nation
plummet. That is in part because of better law enforcement and
longer sentences for criminals. However, this decrease in crime
has taken place in a period where "shall issue" handgun
licenses and permits have become common place. Depending on the
state, between two and five percent of the adult population are
now licensed to carry. Most carry concealed and you would never
know if another person is armed. That's the point. Criminals don't
know either. They don't want to take the risk so person on person
crime is down. While I don't believe that the carry of firearms
is the sole reason for the decrease in this type of crime, enabling
law abiding, trained persons to carry weapons certainly has not
increase mayhem.
You are certainly empowered by law to discriminate against various
types of persons in a private membership club. It's interesting
that you seek to highlight such an ability. I chose not to be
the target of your discrimination, so Sam's Club will be the receipient
of my discount club dollars. Walmart's corporate office has clearly
indicated that state law takes precedent in all Walmarts and Sam's
Club Stores. They do not exercise their right to discriminate
against two to five percent of the population. I will support
them.
I would also suggest that you consider that the Mall Association
of Texas, after serious legal study, advises their members not
to exercise their right to ban legal carry. Their legal advice
suggests that those who limit peoples means to exercise their
legal abilities to protect themselves assume strict liability
for the person's safety. I suggest you make certain that your
legal staff is prepared to defend against lawsuits which arise
if you provide inadequate protection for your disarmed customers.
A soon to be former member
------------------------------------
Stephanie,
After reading a letter it appears you sent in response
to an inquiry about firearms and your stores, I felt compelled
to respond. While you as a private business have every right to
make rules you feel appropriate, I have to say your letter sounded
petty and clearly biased.
Pt #1: Costco does not believe that it is necessary
for firearms to be brought into its warehouse stores, except in
the case of authorized law enforcement officers.
Why does Costco believe that it is necessary for
law enforcement officers to bring firearms into the store? Do
law enforcement officers even need firearms? After all, law enforcement
officers bringing firearms into your warehouse does not enhance
the shopping experience.
Exactly what does Costco think would happen with
concealed carrying members in your warehouse? It would seem to
me that these same people manage to shop elsewhere without causing
mayhem, destruction, or a general degradation of the “shopping
experience”.
Pt #2: For the protection of all our members and
employees, we feel this is a reasonable and prudent precaution
to ensure a pleasant shopping experience and safe workplace.
From the phrase above I can then assume that when
I’m in your warehouse you are responsible for my protection?
It appears from your statement that you are guaranteeing my safety
and protection while I am on your property. You are after all
by your policies saying that I have no need to protect myself
so I would consider it safe to assume that you assume that liability
during my “shopping experience”. If you could please
confirm that it would be great.
It would be an interesting position given that even
the police (referred to as “law enforcement officers”
in you point 1 above) appear to have no obligation to protect
me given the number of court rulings on the matter. Feel free
to research the matter for yourself. I think you will find that
they do not have an obligation to protect me or you for that matter.
(http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=police+have+no+obligation+to+protect)
Given that, I think it’s truly great that
Costco is willing to assume the responsibility for protecting
me during my “shopping experience”. Exactly how much
is Costco willing to pay my children if I were to be killed by
a violent criminal while in your warehouse?
Pt #3: Our policy is meant to protect our members
and employees in all warehouses around the world. This is not
a new policy and we do not customize the policy for each individual
city/county/state/country where we do business.
There’s that protection thing again. Golly
you guys do take this seriously.
You mention that you do not customize “the”
policy for each city/county/state/country where you do business.
Either you are referring specifically to the firearms policy or
you are lying. It would not be possible to not customize ANY policy
by city/county/state/country given the differing laws from place
to place. Based on that I will assume “the” policy
refers to the firearms policy. Wow! If it’s referred to
as “THE” policy at Costco you must hate firearms a
lot!
Pt #4: The shopping experience is not enhanced by
bringing a firearm into our warehouse.
Nor is the “shopping experience” lessened
by a firearm being brought into YOUR warehouse. However my “shopping
experience” is lessened by not being able to protect myself,
my wife, or my children while in your warehouse. While it was
generous of you to offer to be responsible for my protection while
on your property, I really would prefer you not. Since Costco
Membership is only open to limited group of qualified people.
It is clear that gun owners are not “qualified” to
be members. Are there other parts of the Bill of Rights that Costco
hates as much as the 2nd Amendment?
You also made reference to the privilege of being
a member. It doesn’t sound like one to me.
------------------------------------
Sorry guys but this is a Wholesale club, & Costco
does sell gun vaults..
When going to a gun range, it is required that the weapon be in
a closed caring case unloaded.
In a place like Costco a concealed weapon should not be allowed.
Sorry!
--------------------------
Greetings,
I have some questions that could be posed for Costco's
legal department to answer on their 'choosing' to deny the right
of self defense. Here is the email I sent them. Of course there
would have to be a suit filed and it would take years to wind
its way through the courts. However, if JPFO is going to join
into the fight, these questions need to be asked.
By the way, I forwarded your alert to all of our
firearms association members.
Email to Costco follows for your entertainment:
> Looks like Costco (while not in our area...yet)
is trying the same as
> some other companies did years ago in banning CCW holders
the right of
> self protection while in their stores. This particular tact
you are
> using is that Costco is NOT open to the public and is a PRIVATE
club.
>
> So let’s see here.
>
> Can a member of the general public walk in off the street
to walk your
> isles to see if they want to join and if their prices are
worth the
> membership?
>
> If YES, then the store is open to the general public, they
just can't
> purchase without a membership.
> If NO, then would the person requesting such a 'walk through'
to see
> if the cost of membership was worth the savings be arrested
for
> TRESPASSING? I seriously doubt it. And if they were to request
a walk
> through would they be 'escorted' and then ejected?
>
>
> Now for another question to ponder. If as a PRIVATE CLUB,
could Costco
> selectively suspend a person’s Civil Rights? Say, not
let Blacks
> purchase or join? How about not allowing Mid Easterners to
join, would
> that be more 'politically correct'? If you CAN discriminate
then I say
> that under equal protection under the law, any store can
become a
> 'members only' club and selectively choose who they can and
can not
> sell to, or serve as in the case of a restaurant for example.
How
> about a MEMBERS ONLY town whereby the 'owners', i.e. members
select
> who can move in a where they can or can not live?
>
> Raise you hands if you think that Constitutional Law and
> constitutionally guaranteed rights can be selectively chosen
for
> people to be allowed to have simply because the individuals
are a
> member of a 'private' club.
>
> Now IF Costco does this successfully, and constitutionally
legally, in
> the name of safety then here is my proposal. Then people,
who are like
> minded, could found a club whereby in order to purchase from
that club
> and to be a member of that club one must have a conceal carry
permit
> and support the 2nd Amendment to it's fullest extent. And
that the
> club store could deny anyone membership who did not support
the 2nd
> Amendment. Which simply means that members must be a member
in good
> standing of a 2nd Amendment organization as a prerequisite
to becoming
> a member and purchase from the club, on line or in person.
Now, raise
> your hand again, if you think such a club would not be sued
by the
> liberal's, i.e. ACLU, within a week of opening its doors
to 'MEMBERS
> ONLY'?
-----------------------------
If this is not the right address please let me know.
In the Sate of Georgia you can go into any "Wholesale Club"
(Costco, BJ's, etc), to purchase prescription medications without
a membership. Since you are not signing Costco's agreement of
rules that they use to take away your CCW rights and ultimately
your civil rights, how can they hide from your rights by the premise
that they are having you sign away your rights?
In most Costco's, that I have been in the pharmacies are stategically
placed deep in the back of the store so you are free to wander
their premises with hopes of luring you into purchasing a membership
by making it necessary to pass other merchandise that you are
restricted from buyiing since you are not a member.
Unfortunately, I am a member of Costco and did not see this is
in their fine print. Since the cost of some prescriptions can
be several hundred dollars and they will not take a check unless
you are a member, I do feel more comfortable carrying my weapon
with large amounts of cash in my pocket.
With the newly released $4.00 generic presciption price offerred
by Walmart, I can assure you that I will not be renewing my membership
with Costco.
-------------------------
Greetings,
I noticed in Stephen P Wenger's daily mailing that
you are following the Costco Gun Ban issue. A week or so ago,
in response to an other article in Wenger's mailing I sent the
following inquiry to Costco via their website "comments"
form, and received the following reply:
(I have cleaned up both of these messages to remove
personal identifiers and "junk" characters resulting
from the mailing programs - I have the unedited originals of these
emails on file)
Cheers,
M
My message to Costco:
--Original Message--
From: XXXXXXXX@yahoo.com
Date: 10/22/2006 10:33:44 AM
To: memberservice@costco.com
Subject: Other
Note this message was submitted through the costco.com
web site customer suggestion page on 10/22/2006 12:00:00 AM at
10:32:20.5055828.
=========================================================
Comment/Suggestion/Request/Question Text:
It has come to my attention that Costco has instituted
a policy prohibiting legally carried firearms in your stores.
This is extremely unfortunate, and I believe short-sighted for
by insisting that your stores be "gun-free zones" you
are in fact making them into "defenseless victim zones."
You are further choosing to exclude from your stores some of the
finest, most responsible, and most law-abiding people in the country
- and in the case of Concealed Weapon Permit Holders these people
have been very thoroughly investigated. By virtue of having a
permit to carry a weapon, you know that they have never been convicted
of a felony, or even a violent misdemeanor in the last 10 years.
You know that they don't have any drug or alcohol addiction, and
no history of mental problems. And you know that their county
sheriff doesn't consider them a threat to them self or others.
Do you know all of that about any of your other customers? My
firearm and I are nearly inseparable - Like Karl Malden and his
American Express Card, I "don't leave home without it!"
As a Business Member of your "club" this policy will
cause me to seriously reconsider my shopping and buying decisions.
Costco's reply:
Reply-To: memberservice@costco.com
To: XXXXXXXX@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Other [#52771]
Dear M,
Thank you for your email to Costco Wholesale.
In reference to your inquiry on our policy disallowing
the carrying of firearms in our warehouse stores.
Costco does not believe that it is necessary for firearms to be
brought into its warehouse stores, except in the case of authorized
law enforcement officers. For the protection of all our members
and employees, we feel this is a reasonable and prudent precaution
to ensure a pleasant shopping experience and safe workplace. Our
policy is meant to protect our members and employees in all warehouses
around the world. This is not a new policy and we do not customize
the policy for each individual city/county/state/country where
we do business.
Bringing a firearm into our warehouse does not enhance the shopping
experience. We are sorry the message you are hearing is that "we
don't want you." It is the firearms that we exclude in the
warehouses, not the carriers.
Thank you,
Costco Wholesale Corporation
memberservice@costco.com
-------------------------------------
Dear Sir :
As an addendum to the JPFO notice that I received .
If Costco wishes to have a no firearms victim disarmament
policy I agree that you should be able to.
It's your property and your right. I am not a member but one time
about two years ago I went to the outlet at Indianapolis on 86th
Street. I am a male and carry a " hand bag" . I went
in and asked the lady door greeter if there was some way I could
come in and look for a particular item. She said yes. But I would
have to get a one day pass. OK how do I go about that ? She proceeded
to tell me the rules as to how to get a pass. After this she asked
to see what was in my hand bag. I saw the posting that Costco
reserves the right to inspect all bags.
It's your property I complied. I showed here every thing in it.
Money, gloves , wallet , sunglasses , reading glasses , medical
compression bandage , ink pen , paper , swiss army knife , letterman
tool , extra car keys , rain hat ,cell phone , flashlights , pepper
spray , two spare magazines for my , oh yes one .45 Cal semi automatic
hand gun.
I obeyed all requests . I was not rude. I complied without protest.
I am white , 48 years of age and usually dress in dockers and
a polo shirt. Yes a persons appearance can be determination of
ones character. That is why I include this. She acted fine and
told me to go to the counter and get my day pass. I did and went
off to look at a utility trailer. A few minuets later two Sheriff's
deputes come up to talk to me. { My wife was waiting in the car
and told me later she saw the two patrol cars come in very quickly.
So I can only guess what your employees told the dispatcher. I
also assume that the store could not find one " man "
to come up and talk to me. } I won't go into the entire discussion
I had with them. But suffice to say after I asked them what their
probable cause was . Then explained why they don't need to be
bothering me. They went away or should I say they went to your
tabled snack area and waited till I left. { Further proving my
appearance and demeanor is professional . They had no reason to
detain me. }
Here are the facts.
1. I obeyed all requests.
2. I was orderly in my conduct.
3. I had broken no laws or company polices. { I was allowed to
enter and the police did not escort me out.}
4. You were sexually selective in your searchers. { I saw different
women come in with hand bags larger than mine and they were not
searched. }
5. I did not spend any money at your store.
6. I will not spend any money at your store in the future.
7.I let anyone that is interested know that you exercise your
right to create a victim disarmament zone.
8. That law enforcement , by court rulings , do not have to protect
individuals.
[ WASHINGTON, June 27, 2005 - The Supreme Court ruled on Monday
that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect
a person from harm, even a woman who had obtained a court-issued
protective order against a violent husband making an arrest mandatory
for a violation. http://flyservers.registerfly.com/members5/policecrime.com/policeprotection.html
http://dial911.itgo.com/
Here is what I'll do for you.
1. I will stay away from your property.
2. I will not sue you for being sexually selective in your searches.
3. I will respect your philosophy and right to only allow law
enforcement to be there with firearms to help out .
4. If I see either employee or patron being accosted , robbed
, beaten , car-jacked or ass raped.
I will turn up the radio and drive on down the street . Knowing
that I have complied and pleased you in not coming on your property
to aid someone with my firearm. There by allowing the professionals
to come to their aid. [ If they wish to .]
5. If I ever am informed of someone suing you for failure to provide
a " safe haven ". I will aid them financially.
Thank you.
DA
-------------------------------------
Thank you.
I absolutely agree with you!
My Costco membership is up for renewal and I will
be sending Costco a letter informing them of the reason I will
not be renewing.
While it is their "right" to REQUEST
members not to carry on their premises, it is my RIGHT to carry
a firearm in order to protect myself and my loved ones.
I will not put myself or my loved ones at increased
danger by shopping in a known "gun-free" environment
where criminals may prey on their victims with an assurance than
they will be the only ones carrying weapons. For much the same
reason I have taken my children out of public schools.
Requiring law-abiding citizens to disarm for "public
safety" is a flawed and naive concept AT BEST and is, in
reality, a plank of the Communist Manifesto which seeks to disarm
the general population in order to establish a totalitarian police
state.
Since Costco imports a significant portion of their
merchandise from Communist China, it is interesting that they
also seek to promote the communist agenda in the U.S. I am sure
most employees are just unwitting dupes. These "useful idiots"
as the communists call them will no longer receive my money.
JU
------------------------------------------
Regarding your Costco Ban,
I have been aware of it for many years. I have spent hours lecturing
Costco employees about their un-american store.
I would resign my membership if not for my mother, who shares
my card. I shop at Sam's Club, at their store cash is king, they
do not try to restrict your constitutional rights, so I shop with
my gun on, in fact the only time I remove my gun is when I'm in
a client's home (then I leave one in my pocket).
------------------------------------
Dear Ms. Bradley:
I just heard about your policy of barring honest
people who are legally licensed to carry a gun, from entering
Costco premises. I can understand that an openly carried gun would
scare your customers and that would not be good for business.
However, the holder of a concealed carry permit
carries just as the name implies, concealed.
Now your policy wouldn't bother me at all because
anyone who had a gun on him, carrying concealed, wouldn't be noticed
by your personnel anyway.
What does bother me is that putting up a sign barring
guns from the premises lets every criminal know that everyone
in the store is defenseless. That disturbs me greatly because
that can put my family and/or myself in harms way.
Regrettably, you won't be seeing me in your store
until all such signs are removed. Too bad, I liked the place.
Very truly yours,
EW
------------------------------------------
What Costco gun ban?
My reply to the news of Costco's gun ban is: "So
what?" Do they have metal detectors? Do they they do body
searches? What will they do if they determine a honest person
is carrying?
This is much to do about nothing. They are simply
exhibiting the usual stupidity that assumes criminals obey rules,
and they are to be pitied for it. My advice is to ignore them,
and go about your business. Just don't fret them by flashing your
piece like an ass.
RP
-----------------------------------------
Re your E-mail, the following is a copy of what
I sent to the link provided in the above mentioned. I wonder if
I will get anything in the way of a reply?
AS
From some comment on the Internet, I see that your
claim re what appears to be your "no firearms in Costco facilities
policy" revolve about the fact that your facilities are not
open to the general public, Costco being a private membership
organization or club.
Re this, I wonder as to the following. Did your
members, those who hold Costco cards vote on this policy, as one
might expect in cases where the membership of a club were involved?
Please advise.
Thank you.
AS
----------------------------------
Certainly COSTCO has a right as a private business
to insist that its members and customers be defenseless against
the lunatics and criminals who will not care about what sign is
posted on the front door or printed in a membership brochure.
In fact, it is likely that a gun ban policy will attract exactly
the type of criminal activity that you seek to prevent, the work
place shooting.
Of course, your customers and members have a right to stop doing
business with COSTCO.
The real question, is will COSTCO feel any responsibility or pay
damages if and when the policy results in unnecessary death and
injury?
JM
------------------------------------
My reply to CostCo gun ban -
sent to Stephanie Bradley
Executive Assistant to:
Joel Benoliel - SVP-Legal & Administration
Paul Latham - VP-Membership, Marketing & Services
sabradley@costco.com
I just read your response to an internet friend about CostCo's
decision to ban firearms in their stores.
By banning firearms in your stores, you are banning me - and my
money - and my whole family - and all of my friends who are also
gun owners
We'll shop elsewhere.
I have a right to carry my sidearm any where I want to go. I am
a very responsible citizen, and I have legal rights to protect
myself.
All you are doing by banning firearms in your store is alienating
some 80 million gun owners in the USA. Even some who choose not
to carry their arms will choose not to do business with you because
of your illogical policy.
Why illogical? Because someone who wants to cause trouble in CostCo
will know that everyone in there is unarmed. It doesn't take a
brain surgeon to figure that out.
Sure, you may have a right to decide that you do not want gun-toting
citizens on your property. But we also have a right to go do our
shopping elsewhere.
So, until you change your policy and welcome gun owners and people
who choose to protect themselves, you'll have to get along without
my business. I'll be watching for the signs at your store that
say welcome to gun owners.
SP
-------------------------------
Hi:
I wrote to Costco regarding this and received the
following:
Thank you for your email to Costco Wholesale.
In reference to your inquiry on our policy disallowing
the carrying of firearms in our warehouse stores.
Costco does not believe that it is necessary for firearms to be
brought into its warehouse stores, except in the case of authorized
law enforcement officers. For the protection of all our members
and employees, we feel this is a reasonable and prudent precaution
to ensure a pleasant shopping experience and safe workplace. Our
policy is meant to protect our members and employees in all warehouses
around the world. This is not a new policy and we do not customize
the policy for each individual city/county/state/country where
we do business.
Bringing a firearm into our warehouse does not enhance the shopping
experience. We are sorry the message you are hearing is that "we
don't want you." It is the firearms that we exclude in the
warehouses, not the carriers.
Thank you,
Costco Wholesale Corporation
memberservice@costco.com
I wrote back canceling my membership and my family's
membership....made no difference. Costco wants sheep, not customers.
Life Member
JB
----------------------------------
The note below is a message I sent to CostCo.
Tim A.
"The letter below confirms just how ANTI- American
that CostCo really is. You can be sure that I will never allow
my shopping needs to become a CostCo member. Why don't you move
your business to North Korea, or China where your kind of beliefs
belong?"
---------------------------------
Thanks for the update.
--------------------------------
Dear Ms Bradley:
Greetings - I hope this note finds you well!
I have learned that Costco forbids firearms carry within its boundaries.
Allow me to say that no one without malicious intent is any threat
to Costco or its visitors, but those few who are will not heed
a Costco regulation forbidding people to carry a firearm. In fact,
visitors and staff are at greater danger with the prohibition
of means for those who would assist in putting down a threat to
people and normal business intercourse.
Costco's allowance of peace officer servants to do so as a matter
of official business is not out of line, but I wonder if Costco
is aware of the fact that police have the highest accidental discharge
rates from unsafe handling of any group of firearms users. And,
I wonder if Costco is aware of the fact that peace officers are
known within shooting circles nationwide as the most inaccurate
and unsafe people at the range? I also wonder if Costco applies
the same standards to off-duty servants as normal people, or if
a double standard exists.
I have carried a firearm on Costco premises a number of times,
and you are none the worse for it. If there had been a threat
that would best have been served by an immediate armed response,
would you have preferred to dial 911 and waited a full minute
or two for a response from elsewhere while carnage played its
way out and hostages that will later sue you were taken, or would
you have preferred a citizen immediately came to the aid of fellow
citizens while at the same time refusing to be a voluntary victim?
In this hypothetical, you're going to be sued either way, but
less so in the latter case. The rose colored glasses of a violence
free society must come off, also, because society has never been
without it, nor will it be so long as time exists.
In the mean time I have instructed my precious wife to shop elsewhere,
until Costco repeals demands she discard her only means of self
defense against such an aggressor. We will not cooperate with
you by leaving something so delicate as our personal safety in
the hands of "professionals".
Sincerely,
JC
---------------------------------------
dear ms. bradley:
i trust costco has considered the ramifications
of its announced policy of banning guns on its premises, the most
obvious being costcop, by denying members the right to self-defense,
has assumed the responsibility of defending and protecting those
members. failure to do so must surely subject costco to liability
in tort for assuming the duty to defend and failing to do so.
sincerely,
DT
------------------------------------
As a matter of interest, I visited the Costco store
in [redacted], Arizona recently and saw the "NO FIREARMS
ALLOWED" sign at the entrance. I went inside to the Customer
Service desk and asked to see the floor manager, who appeared
fairly quickly. She informed me that as long as I had a concealed
weapon permit, she had no problem with my carrying my firearm
in the store.
She didn't feel comfortable putting that in writing,
however, and while we didn't discuss it, there is the problem
that she is not the only floor manager. I obtained from her the
address of the corporate headquarters and wrote them a polite
letter, pointing out all the fallacies of their position. I also
enclosed one of the cards from the Firearms Coalition which points
out "gun bans ensure only lawbreakers will be armed"
(etc., etc. They never answered the letter.
-------------------------------------------
I have just learned that Costco does not want its
members to carry firearms in its stores.
Since I have never been asked if I am carrying
a concealed handgun when I entered any of your stores, this has
not been a problem for me in the past.
I have a license to carry concealed handguns and
intend to do so whenever I choose to.
I have been a Costco member for many years, I enjoy
being a member, I don't want to quit, but I will have give serious
thought to quitting if I am ever challenged as I enter one of
your stores.
JL
-------------------------------
SELF DEFENSE AT COSTCO MEANS....SHOP SOMEWHERE
ELSE
STEPHANIE BRADLEY: The shopping experience is not
enhanced by bringing a firearm into our warehouse.
ME: Thank you for your opinion, but it is defective and inaccurate.
STEPHANIE BRADLEY: Our primary goal at Costco Wholesale
is to keep our members happy.
ME: Well, that doesn't seem to be working out, does it?
-----------------------------
BULL I SHOP THERE AND I ALWAYS CARRY.
